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In this discussion, Dr.SHIVA Ayyadurai, MIT PhD, the Inventor of Email, Candidate for President of the United States, reveals the TRUE Nature of the Lesser of TWO Evils.

Transcript Below.

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Art everyone, good evening, good afternoon, good morning, wherever you are. Today we’re going to have a really good discussion with Nick Griffin, who is a former member of parliament in London, and he’s going to be interviewing me. And I’m going to focus on many things, but the focus is about the real lesser of two evils.

We tend to think the lesser of two evils just means the left and the right, but we’re going to really talk about is that the real lesser of two evils is something much more sinister than that. So we’re going to talk about the real lesser of two evils. And my systems analysis of that again, it’s a common theme, but we’re going to go a little bit deeper into it among talk a number of issues with Nick Griffin.

How are you, Nick?

I’m fine. Thank you very much. It’s good to have you here. Yes, so we can start. I’m all set on my end. Okay, let me just hit this record there. Yep. So you’re recording it, but so am I doing this as a show that I’m doing it or is it? We can do both. I’m co streaming and you can do it. We can do it. I think we have very different audiences.

So we have, yes, certainly. Okay, so I’ll hit record and I’ll just introduce you. I’ll say who we are, then give you a couple of moments to introduce yourself to a UK audience. And I think it’s probably good for you to also introduce yourself. You know your background. I can start first. Is that better?

Okay. All right. Let’s do that. Okay. Nick, so as many people know I’m running for president in the United States, and my background is very different than the other three Zionist hoodlum candidates who are running all of them are pro Zionist all of them support. One of them, Boobie Effing Kennedy, as I call him, he actually believes that the Palestinian people are the most pampered people on the world.

Trump essentially was anointed and put in power by Netanyahu, if you actually look at the work of James Borfman, and obviously everyone knows where Biden stands. So it’s very interesting that in the history of the United States to become I think you have a member of parliament in the in, in London or a member of legislative assembly, but in the United States, 99 percent of these people are supported by the Israeli lobby.

Yes, the conclusion is America is occupied. And when we look at a lot of these free Palestinian movements, and we’ll talk more about this. Is they do not understand that it is only when we end the occupation of America from Zionism can even Palestine be liberated. So this is a very fundamental thing.

But to me, my journey to all of this started in India, Nick, where I grew up in a, in the caste system of India, which again, the Brahmanism system is very similar to Zionism, very similar to Nazism, because when you look at it, they all believe a small set of people. Have the right to rule over the 8 billion of us.

It’s fundamental to the, so Brahmanism equals Nazism is Zionism. I grew up in that. caste system. Rishi Sunak profited from that caste system. Talk more about it. But that’s my background. So my journey was to the United States knowing that. So I worked very hard, earned a bunch of degrees at MIT, including my PhD.

I was deeply interested in politics and medicine because of that background. And that all converged when I came to the discoveries that if we are going to fundamentally create a world that we deliver truth, freedom, health, it can only happen by. Having a theoretical framework, a systems theory. And that’s one of the things I built.

And that became the basis of our movement for truth, freedom, health, which really powers our campaign. So you say, when did you first actually dive into politics? What year? Oh my God, I’ve been involved into politics since I was a four year old kid. When I experienced this awful caste system in India, where You know, I was playing with a young friend of mine who I thought was my friend and I went to his home and his mother wouldn’t let me into his home, started spitting at me and calling me the n word equivalent because, in India they have the shudra term.

And that’s when I was, I asked my mom what this meant and she said, oh yeah, there’s this caste system. And I got very interested. I started reading everything I could. When I came to MIT when I was 17, 18, I got a little more interested in electoral politics. You may remember that was when Reagan was running against a guy called Mondale, and there was a quote, unquote, a third quote, unquote, independent candidate Jesse Jackson.

He claimed he was anti establishment, but at the end of the day, he was a wing of the left. Just like the left and the right establishment parties have their wings to sucker people in into the fold, right? So that’s what I realized I think by the time I was 18 that none of these You know Establishment parties or their wings work.

We have to build independent bottoms up movements and if any change has ever taken place It’s always been through these independent movements That’s been my trajectory as an activist. And then I got into electoral politics in 2016 when I ran against a woman called Elizabeth Warren, you may know her, she’s a woman who claimed that she was a minority Native American, we ran a campaign said only the real Indian can defeat the fake Indian.

And we got, it was a very powerful campaign. And then the next year we ran as Republicans and that’s when we realized the establishment Republican party does not want any independence. And that’s when I expose the election fraud in Massachusetts that exposed the backdoor portal into Twitter. And that’s when we realized we have to truly build an independent movement and that’s what our campaigns were.

Yeah. So to me, this has been a long journey. Interesting. I started a long journey in politics. I grew up in a very political family in living in London. Very right wing conservatives and was brought up. with a view you’ll be in politics, you’ll become a conservative MP one day you could become leader of the Conservative Party.

And at the age of 15 I concluded that the the Conservatives, they, in some areas they would talk. a good fight. They would never deliver. In other things they were talking about, if they delivered, it would be bad in any case. So I joined a very extreme right wing nationalist party, the National Front and was involved in that for some years.

It was basically an insurgent working class party with some, it had a lot of people at the beginning who’d were involved in Britain’s war effort in the Second World War. It was full of rear admirals and squadron leaders and such but under the relentless pressure, particularly from the Zionist bloc within Britain who demonized it absolutely ruthlessly it became a self fulfilling prophecy, basically they said it’s full of you.

Skinhead, thug, right wing extremist, neo Nazis, and it tended to attract people like that. So I left that in 1989, had a couple of years in the wilderness, and then joined the British National Party, which was a rather similar party, to be honest, but I concluded that You had to have, obviously, a party machine and it was the only one which, for all its faults, and it had many, it was anti establishment and it was anti Zionist.

And I’d already seen enough of the Zionist lobby working in Britain to see that really they were the people who in so many ways were blocking. anyone trying to advance and really discuss serious issues, not just about Palestine, but all sorts of issues also at home. And so I got involved in that, was elected to lead in 1999 and we ran an electoral insurgency, which terrified the British elite for 10 years, every single election that was held in England the subtext of other, apart from which party of the union party was going to win, the Conservatives or the Labour Party, the subtext was how terrifying the British National Party was and how dangerous it was.

And the peak of that, I was elected, you’re quite right, in the intro there I was elected to a seriously high office, which was a member of the European Parliament. It’s almost impossible to break through. In mainstream into mainstream British politics, because rather like America, we have the first past the post system all across Europe.

We have various forms of proportional representation, which make it much easier for alternative parties to break through. And in the case of the European elections, Britain adopted this proportional representation system. So I was elected as an MEP in 2009 and served for five years. This is before Brexit, right?

This was before Brexit. I don’t know, I don’t know your opinion on Brexit, but my opinion was I was a committed opponent of Britain’s membership of, which was basically the United Soviet States of Europe from even before it happened. And I was committed to Brexit. And of course the British National Party never got anywhere near delivering that.

There was a great irony however, that in order to stop me and the British National Party, the British establishment, especially the BBC, promoted Nigel Farage, who is again one of these absolutely fake Zionist, anti establishment candidates. They promoted him so much. He was on all their programs, serious political programs.

They also even put him on comedy programs. And this was specifically, and it was openly admitted, they were promoting Farage in order to stop Griffin. And the unintended consequence of this, of course, was they promoted Farage and Ukip so much that David Cameron, the Conservative leader, was forced for electoral reasons to give them a referendum, which they expected the stay in Europe would win.

And it was only a huge grassroots insurgency from basically the blue collar white working class which pushed us over the line to get Brexit. So it wouldn’t have happened. But for the BBC promoting Farage to stop me so inadvertently, it’s one of the two major successes of my political career thus far.

Yeah, it’s really interesting, Nick. I titled this, the quote unquote, the lesser of two evils. Yeah, we we tend to think, when we launched our campaign, we said the lesser of two evils is what the establishment has been promoting. Or, so an election occurs at, two to four years.

You typically have the lesser of two evils and people typically compromise. And the brainwashing is you have to compromise for one of the lesser of two evils. Now, in the United States, what’s occurred is if you look at the last 60 years, one key performance indicator of this philosophy. If you have a child today in the United States, and we have this up on our website on Shiva for presidents and a flyer, the life span of your child today will be less than you.

And it’s not because just the vaccine or something like this is a systemic policy that has taken place over the last 60 years that has destroyed people’s biology in a sense, actual policies which have hurt people’s biology, typically working people. So one of the focus of what we’ve been educating, and I think this may align with what you’re sharing, is that the goal of the establishment is to make sure that working people get demoralized, and this is their singular focus, so we never build these independent movements, and we never elect leaders who are one of our own, that we always compromise, and Nigel Farage I remember when I met him many years ago over at one of the Trump hotel thing, you could, he was essentially a puppet that was put in there to be the fake anti establishment.

And so the lesser of two evils now is not just the left or the right, but it’s the obvious establishment. Like the David Camerons or, the Tony Blair’s, the obvious people. And then they have the not so obvious establishment, right? Absolutely. Labor party leaders, or in this case in the United States, we have the obvious establishment, which was always, let’s say the Clintons and the Bushes.

And they always metamorphosize too, right? They vary. And then the not so obvious establishment is they had to create people like Trump on the quote unquote or Boobie Kennedy on the left. Or Tulsi Gabbard or Bernie Sanders. So the sophistication of the swarm, as I call them, is that they have the obvious establishment and they know people are breaking from that typically working people and they’re heading anti establishment, so they create characters like Nigel Farage.

They create characters like Trump to basically sucker people back into the establishment. But I think what’s good about the issue of Zionism, it’s a wonderful litmus test in many ways. Because it forces the hand of the obvious and the not so obvious establishment. Yes, absolutely expose themselves.

So the Zionism issue is a very interesting issue in the United States. We’ve been pounding away not only on this issue, but in 2020, I was the first exposed the backdoor portal into Twitter and you could see the reaction of people like quote unquote, I call him Effer Carlson, or Joe Rogan and all these people who claim to be anti establishment, but they never tell the truth at the right time.

They reveal the truth when it’s convenient and it’s never to mobilize people into action. So with that broad understanding, Nick, what’s happened is we’ve been exposing people who the real lesser of two evils are. It is on the one hand, the obvious establishment, and then the establishment creates its not so obvious version.

Who spouts all these words. And this is the teaching and the learning. I think the broad set of working people need to understand because otherwise they get stuck into a Nigel Farage or Donald Trump or a booby Kennedy or Bernie Sanders. And this is how the left and the right keep, the machinery going.

They have the obvious establishment, but they have the wings of people who literally copy the words. Of the real fighters for change mimics your words. Absolutely, sir. It’d be nice to hear more from you on the not so obvious. You know the establishment characters and like jeremy corbyn obviously labor party guy, right?

Yes, indeed Yeah, but I think it’d be valuable to educate the u. s audience on this nature of the yes Yeah, there’s different levels to this There’s the obvious there’s the the wings of the uni party And the labor party being the left wing of the uni party, right? then they still felt the need to in effect split this between the Party the Blairite, Stama, thoroughly respectable very Zionist ones and Corbyn and similar, who are almost independent, they’re almost alright, but then they’re not, they always come back and they never go that, they never go that far in Britain, the, we didn’t have this.

The powers that be were happy, I think. They were content with just the uniparty with the two wings, and the electorate were happily or unhappily switching one to the other, voting against them because they’re even worse than them. And it seemed to do the job. And when we created or built the British National Party as a serious electoral challenge, and it was paralleled by serious election challenges by nationalist parties.

Other part, other parts of Europe as well. And until probably about 2006, 2007, the reaction of the power elite to all these insurgencies was always the same. It was to to simply to demonize to, to use Lawfare to use the violence of the SOS funded Antifa. These plausibly deniable establishments gangs of thugs and and presenters of being absolutely unacceptable and beyond the pale.

And this worked until about 2005. And at that point and around that period, the old parties were becoming so unpopular with ordinary people, especially working people who are thoroughly betrayed that the more they attacked the radical outsiders, the more it was actually convincing people that we were different.

Because when we were knocking doors through the early 2000s, the most common reason we got the people saying no, I’m not going to vote for you wasn’t because of who we were able to say politicians, you’re all the damn same. I wouldn’t vote for any of you. And the more that they were attacking the.

the radical anti Zionist right all across Europe. The more, at this stage, it was actually convincing the public we were different and it was therefore building our votes rather than damaging. And it was sometime after that, around between 2006, 2008, that they suddenly developed some light bulb moments in their operation that they realized it was far better to present people with a fake.

phony patriotism reaction against the system, proper workers party, whatever. Far better to give them fakes than to try and then to promote those fakes as being a little bit less obnoxious than the people they really feared. And that’s what they’ve been doing ever since. So we’ve now got the position basically all over Europe.

The serious challenge by genuine opponents of the system is gone effectively. And in every single country, you’ve got things like Marine Le Pen. The Front National’s a classic example. Jean Marie Le Pen, he had his faults, but he, I knew him very well. He was a very old man. He was a very genuine man.

And he put his, nailed his colours to the mast. wore his heart on his sleeve, and he was there for France and so on. Marine Le Pen’s daughter, on the other hand, is an absolute snake, and has simply sold the party to a combat, she surrounded herself by Zionists and homosexuals. Ah, and so it’s completely controlled.

And the same is true the a FD and so on. All these parties across Europe that I think Americans perhaps look to as being, oh they’re the future. No, they’re not because they’re another part of this controlled opposition, which obviously you’ve seen through in the USA and I. I, I wish you well on that.

Can I ask you a bit about the US presidential election? Yeah. Nick, one thing I wanna just mention to people listening in the US is that. In the United States, when you run for president, let’s say, or you run for any type of office, it’s winner takes all, right? So you just get this, two party system, or maybe some fake bullshit independence, like booby Kennedy, that’s their Zionist other front man.

So now they have three Zionist heads, right? Democrat Republican, and booby. But what’s interesting is in, in some ways, the democratic process, quote unquote, democratic process that you have. In England and other countries like that is you have a parliamentary system. A lot of Americans don’t understand this that it’s based on the percentage of votes that you get so that’s why you have you can have a range of different political parties you actually have a better shot in some sense in the united states certainly true in europe. Yes Yeah. Yeah. I’m not saying it’s perfect. It’s probably but there is a difference that so if you run for office You And I get, 40 percent of the vote and you get 30 percent and someone gets the other remaining 30%, you get that proportional, representation.

That’s true across most of Europe. It’s not true in Britain. We’ve got a we’re closer in fact to the American system. I see. I see. It was only in the European elections and in elections for the London Assembly and in Scotland and Wales, the divided parliaments. There you have a system which is If it wasn’t for the overwhelming control of the narrative by the controlled mass media, you would have a system which was fairly democratic.

In British parliamentary elections, it’s also winner takes all. Oh, I see. Okay. So we’re very much more like yours. Yeah. Yeah. So the other point I wanted to make was know you have a number of questions where I want to go through, but the other point is in the United States, the evolution was in the late 1800s and early 1900s.

There was quite a. Massive upsurge. They called it the great upheaval of the American working class fighting independently for their rights So they actually had bottoms up trade unions bottoms up movements and then by the 1950s the so called right branded all those movements as though they were being run out of capital c communist russia and then the Left took over these unions top down.

So during the period of 1900 to 1970 There were actually quite a bit of bottoms up movements truly bottoms up movements by people and that’s why the united states was forced to give a lot of these gains And the working class’s income actually Even the first and second tier, the lowest income quartiles, their income went up along with every other tier, right?

Cause they worked, you worked hard, you got your future, your labor. And there were close to, 200 million people who took to the streets in those movements, truly independent populist movements. But after 1970, the left and the right coordinated their efforts. One took over the unions, the so called left and the other basically undercut working people.

So between 1970 until today, what’s interesting is there has been socialism. It’s been socialism for the elites, about 40 to 50 trillion has been transferred. And there’s been no and any type of formidable force against all of this has been manipulated by what we call these fake martyrs, fake heroes.

So that’s what the, I think, the real lesser of two evils is the Establishment, quote unquote, academic intellectuals realize that they must demoralize any of these bottoms up movements. So they, and probably it was coordinated with Britain, Oxford and Harvard coming up with these models to say that they would create.

The fake anti establishment heroes, and they’ve done it. And now the good news in the United States, if our movement didn’t exist, we’ve been hammering away at this. So I had to do the unfortunate job of exposing Trump. We had to do the unfortunate job of exposing Kennedy. We would lose 20 percent of our followers.

But the good thing is Nick, what’s occurred is there’s a enough people besides just me who’ve taken. Our analysis of this and they’re hammering them. So this has never existed before. The concept of educating a broad mass of people on this dynamic of the controlled opposition and that they are created by the establishment.

But the issue of Zionism, I think gives us a huge opportunity. To separate Zionism from, the anti Semite, or anti Semitism from anti Zionism. And so you can see in the United States our work has been, really been very powerful. Even people like Elon Musk, who’s part of the censorship infrastructure, he puts back this fool called Nick Fuentes back on, who is indeed And anti Semite, in the, or pro Nazi because they want to blur again, the education people have been learning between anti Semitism and anti Semitism, anti Zionism.

So they want that blurred. They don’t want people like myself clearly explaining that, which we’ve done. So I just wanted to give you the, so the real lesser of two evils is this very perpetual force, which is realized in order to keep people stuck to the swarm, they keep dropping these fake heroes. And I think they have a.

Whole lineup of them, at least in the, they farm them. They have a university that generates these people. It’s very interesting to say university, because I was looking here in Britain, we’ve got, obviously we’ve got a it’s a very small country. It’s now very poor, basically, if you’re poor and in a poor area and we’ve got a very large Muslim population, the youth of which have been, or were extremely radicalized by vast amounts of Saudi Wahhabi money.

Pouring in. Yeah, who are all pro Zionist. Indeed, who are all pro Zionist. Now, that radicalization has stopped to a degree, because the Saudis, basically, have changed they’ve cut their religious fanatics down to size, somewhat. So that stopped somewhat, but we still got this intense, very dangerous division between the white working class And the muslims and then there’s indian elements etc in other places.

It’s a very unstable dangerous thing. And for a long time, the US based Zionist billionaires were pouring vast amounts of money into an attempt to create a clash between the Muslims and the rest on the streets of Britain. So they were promoting obscene cartoons of Muhammad and stuff like this, literally hoping and saying this will create a race war.

This is what we want. Now, it didn’t happen partly because, or mainly actually because the young Muslims simply didn’t respond to this. They saw people like Tommy Robinson as Zionist scarecrows. They realized this doesn’t represent the broader white working class. So they stayed away from that. But this was, this is 10 years ago now, they were trying to do this really, but more than 10 years, there was this push.

But in recent years, sorry, so that was purely Zionist billionaires pushing absolute pushing from the gutter. for trouble. But in the last few years, I’ve been looking more and you mentioned university. So you’re aware of Prager you the online university and it’s one of, there’s a, there’s an enormous range of Zionist funded organizations which are no longer just promoting a rough and ready boots and bricks and bottles, street violence.

They’re promoting whole civilizational ethos. a clash of civilizations and it’s clear to me that having failed to create a civil war to keep us all amused while they carry on doing what they want to do, having failed to do that with a working class, they are now trying, certainly in Britain, but I think Prager U operates in the States and so on, I think that they’re trying to create a middle class cadre who are committed to race, racial and religious violence.

As a way of cleansing everything and to an extent where I come from politically, I’m closer to them than I am, I was closer to them than I am to you, to be quite blunt about it and honest, but I’ve seen the consequences of civil wars up close and very ugly in Northern Ireland, in Syria, where I’ve been a number of times, and neither side would win.

It’s the radical Wahhabi Muslims tell their youngsters, one push and the whole of white society will collapse and we’ll take over Britain and Allah wills it and they won’t. And the the idiot moron, ex skinhead, big fat white idiots, drunks and so on they think, oh we’ll just have this we’ll seize power and we’ll force them all to go home.

But again, you can’t force five, six, seven, eight million people. When especially Western interference in their countries, financial and military has caused so much damage to those countries that they’re here because we helped screw up their countries. I still believe. One second where did you say that?

We have a difference there? I didn’t understand. What? You and me, where we came from? Because I, you said we have a difference in this one area. I didn’t. Oh, I see. Yeah. I think there’s a difference in America and Britain. Oh, you’re saying America and Britain. I see. Yes. Yeah.

So that America hasn’t got this very, obviously you’ve got Muslim immigration, but it’s not on a scale in really poor areas against. An angry working white working class is not on a scale which can cause real problems. I think, but I think if there’s a racial divide in America that they can exploit, presumably it’s black and white with Soros funded black lives matter things, yeah, I think, look, I think we, I think when we say you, you’re talking about you meaning America. Not me. Yeah. So I think we probably look in the United States the quote unquote, lesser of two evils, both wings of the establishment have been using immigration as an issue. Okay. And neither of them, quote unquote, wants to solve immigration.

So if you look at, it’s the same thing, we have our movement, has a lot of people in Latin America now. Okay. So we had our big Latin American summit, core leaders showed up and the emphasis there, it’s pretty easy to see. That the elites, the swarm, whatever we want to call them in the, I like to call them the swarm because they’re not localized.

They’re much more a multiracial distributed, decentralized aristocracy of people, these people always bring immigration because the goal is to pit the immigrant, the brown skin immigrant who’s coming from the Southern part of the, Latin America with the white working class predominantly. And the reality is it’s the same reality here.

It was through starting with john kennedy, right? Who’s an imperialist? In many ways, right? And all the way through all these Zionist presidents, they’re the ones who invaded large parts of Latin America. They’re the ones who subjugated these people. This is left out of the historical understanding from, all these people.

And so the immigration is occurring because of U. S. imperialism in these countries. And what’s interesting is many of those people come here, most of them actually work very hard. They’re the ones who cut the lawns and do landscaping. There’s a large part of the unemployed white working class who’s kept to not work.

That phenomenon I think is spectacularly the same. It’s a basically create this hatred among white and Brown people, or immigrants, which is what America was built on and other people who are forcibly in many ways, incentivized not to work anymore. Yeah. So that phenomenon, so I think the idea of pitting working people against each other to create that civil war and to demoralize people to not, so I think they moved from the civil war model, which is to get people to fight to the demoralization model, demoralize these people to think there is no hope you have to choose one of the lesser of two evils, worse than ever before and they’ve created these fake Transcribed Martyrs and these fake heroes, and they’ve gotten very sophisticated at doing that.

So they have indeed, I agree entirely other than I think that the model has been demoralization, possibly Britain’s a little bit ahead of this. There’s a tendency of people to think, it’s all us imperialism say in Ukraine, for instance, it’s all us imperialism doing this and Britain’s just a tail on the dog.

I think the other way around. Yeah, exactly. When you really look deeply at the the fake gas attacks and so on in Douma, for instance, in Syria, that we used to try to drag the West into war. If you look at Boris Johnson going to Kiev and simply scuffering a peace deal, which was there for the taking.

Everyone was there. It’s very, somehow, despite Britain being an economic basket case in terms of deep state, the British deep state is still a hugely powerful thing, which has big influences in the USA, unfortunately. But what I think is the case here is that Demoralization, especially the white working class, what has been used in Britain on a mega scale, we’ve got exactly the same thing.

All these people complain about immigrants coming in. They’re all sitting around on the dole themselves, not working. Exactly like that. And the system has been made so that they can just get by and perhaps they do a little bit of work on the black, which then means that they’re breaking the law.

And so they’re completely controlled but I think that in Britain, we can see that they’re moving away from that because, as I was saying before, there’s this multi billion pound dollar push to create amongst young, younger, more middle class white people, the ones who, if you’re going to have a movement very much.

Traditionally and generally, they’re the ones who are the movers and shakers and make things happen. They’re being taken out of demoralization and made very angry now. And they’re being made angry because they want us to fight each other. And I would guess that because this, Out of the five eyes, the British elite establishment, deep state still has this almost a leading role.

I would guess that you’ll see this clearer and clearer in the USA in coming years. And it’s a very frightening thing indeed. They’re pouring billions into bluntly make turning the white man from being a rather pathetic cow liberal. Into being fighting mad and angry, and actually we’ve got a lot to be angry about, but they’re going to make us fight the wrong people.

Yeah. What’s it, what’s what’s interesting is, in 2020, when I ran for office as a Republican. We won that election. We had 3000 volunteers on the ground in a Senate race. We had working class people supporting us and that’s when, I never thought election quote unquote fraud took place in the United States.

I was the one who uncovered it because in my own election, we won in a all white working class community by 10 points and we, you couldn’t leave Massachusetts, Nick, without ever seeing. sign. It was quite amazing, right? So we lost 40 and all the other eight counties where we actually did more campaigning to a invisible candidate.

So that’s when I uncovered that they had also, they could flip votes on these machines and they had a and they’ve deleted ballot images. So I was the first one who brought this whole issue up. And when I exposed this on social media, on Twitter, I was thrown off Twitter. Not by Twitter throwing me off, but the government of Massachusetts contacted Twitter.

And I had to do that lawsuit, and I proved that in federal court. This is in 2020. We wrote to Effer Carlson. He did nothing. Glenn Greenwald did nothing against a fake anti establishment guy. What ended up happening is that I discovered this entire infrastructure. If you go to winbackfreedom. com, we exposed all of this and in federal court, and it was me against seven lawyers.

And I was winning against Harvard trained lawyers. I was doing my own briefs ahead of Wilmer and Hale. Twitter’s law firm didn’t even think that I was writing my own briefs, but I’d gotten pretty good at that. But what was interesting was we discovered this entire infrastructure. The reason I’m sharing this with you was this infrastructure wasn’t done by the United States.

It was headquartered and directed out of England by the Atlantic Council. So the Atlantic Council with the Belfer School at Harvard had realized that the United States government constitutionally could not directly censor U. S. citizens on U. S. soil. They could do that to foreign citizens. So they created this entire backdoor infrastructure to social media companies.

Which I, detailed in gross detail, if you go to winbackfreedom. com, we were publishing all our lawsuits as it was going and what we uncovered, Nick, was that the government of Massachusetts had used this infrastructure to silence a U. S. Senate political candidate, and it came out in courtroom testimony.

This is in 2020. Again, all the so called anti establishment media grifters did nothing, they concealed the story, they waited two years to do a limited hangout. But the important thing was this was directed out of the Atlantic Council to Harvard. So a lot of people do not understand Oxford, United Kingdom, MI6, a real deep state still resides in my view, comes out of the theoretical framework of Britain, and they directed the Belfer School to say, look, we need to create a way to launder censorship.

So they created a non profit entity. Which is funded by Pierre Omidyar the Zuckerbergs, the guys out of Fox News, Murdoch’s, and so you could a government official could contact this clearinghouse, the clearinghouse would silence someone like me who’s exposing actual election malfeasance, you say?

So the point is the deep connection and the theoretical commandeering, still a lot of it is done out of Britain because they were masters of it for many years. And and you see that right now, it was dear, it was Britain with Cecil Rhodes, Who basically had to make, Kaiser Wilhelm absolutely savage and evil, that started World War I.

That same model is being used against the Palestinian people, right? And so there’s, so British, or Zionism, gets a lot of its theoretical grounding on how to do a lot of this coming out of Britain. Yeah I use the phrase in Britain that this is an Anglo Zionist elite this thing. It is part, it’s partly, as you say, it goes back to Cecil Rhodes, the round table etc.

It’s heavily influenced now by Zionism, but actually some of the world’s very first Zionists, there was a section of the Protestant Puritan movement in the 17th century. Yeah. Which was Zionist, Before the Jews was Zionist. Yeah, but Martin Heckler, these guys who were doing the eschatological view of Christianity.

Yes. Yeah, it goes back a long way. Yep. Yeah. So what’s the strange thing? Because that section of British Protestantism was always dissenting. It’s it was never part of the establishment, but somehow it’s I suppose because it had a small group of people pushing an agenda when everyone they’re pushing it through.

We’re just in it for them, perhaps for themselves or because they’re a bit patriotic or because their father told them to do it, whatever it is. If you’ve got a mass of people in an organization or an establishment who don’t really have a common goal, And you have one small group, which has a laser focus, common goal they cut through everything.

So we’ve now got this, as I say this, I regard it as an Anglo Zionist establishment in Britain, and it has immense influence, still in Europe to cite the fact that we’ve left the European Union. And also on the USA. Can I ask you saying how, basically, you’ve had an election stole a lot election stolen.

I know exactly the same. Yeah, we’ve had the same thing in Britain. I know you’re telling the truth because I’ve seen it at first hand, but how then. Very much. You’re still standing in elections. How what’s your Theoretical model of a revolution to change all this when even if you win they will cheat so you don’t win It’s a great question So what I realized nick was this that when I looked at the arc of human history And you really ask a question, how does change take place?

Or for that matter, from an engineering standpoint, how do you build a bridge? You can’t build a bridge with that Newtonian mechanics, right? You can’t, build an iPhone without understanding, let’s say, electromagnetism, Maxwell’s equations, and a lot of people don’t understand this, So the question I’ve always, since I was a child was, what are the physics of building a movement that does lead to revolutionary change?

And what that led me, I wrote a book many years ago called System and Revolution, right? So the fact is, what is a revolution? What is a revolution? So philosophers and lawyers and, people like that have typically been at the forefront of, In politics, right? John Locke or Lenin or Marx or Amigo the, the German philosophers, you can go down the list, right?

Socrates, Plato, but what I realized was that in order to understand what is revolution, or what is a system, which is what’s necessary, that it was only in the 1920s. And by the 1950s, we really had the theoretical framework to do that, which was the work of people like Norbert Wiener and people like when the Nobel prize in physical chemistry.

So what I’m saying is that there was a fundamental lack of knowledge to understand this phenomenon of how do you what is revolutionary change? And I’m intersecting this because from your own country, when Isaac Newton created define the laws of mechanics. That same day, you created a dichotomy between religion and science because the religious folks thought, Oh my God, Newton is describing a mechanistic view of the world, therefore, everything is a clock that wears a room for God.

So over those 400 years till today, we’ve had this mechanistic view of the world that if you collect enough data, you can create the loss to project into the future and to the, and before it’s a very fundamental concept. Issue in the 1800s when the laws of thermodynamics came, there was a problem with this because the law, the second law of thermodynamics said that everything goes to a state of disorder.

So how do you converge the fact that Newtonian mechanics saying everything’s ordered, you can predict your motion, my emotion, the motion of all particles. And then another body of science is saying everything goes to a state of disorder. This was not resolved until 1957, where the reality is that both.

Exist together, right? And that’s where my work began as an engineering systems, PhD, et cetera, was resolving this notion of a mechanistic world and the reality that you have chaos and out of it appears where things, deterministic worlds emerge. It’s quite fascinating. My position goes to recognizing that we have to understand how systems work.

And that’s, so I, I took where Perjoni left off and my work at MIT. And thereafter was looking at engineering system science and then looking at, believe it or not, ancient systems of medicine out of India. And you find out when you put these together, that there are nine principles that emerge that are exactly the same that you can describe.

So for example, if you look at control systems theory, your thermostat Or an autopilot that flies a plane. This is why the modern civilization is based on engineering control system science, where you set a goal, you have the phenomenon that you can see what’s going on, and then you can control these systems, input, you look at the output, you look at sensors.

Anyway, I’m not going to get into that. But the bottom line is that there is a physics, Nick, that I came across. And then I organized that into a curriculum, which I used to teach at MIT. George Soros, who is one of the theoreticians of reflexivity theory. People need to understand the reason that a small set of people are able to manipulate 8 billion people is because they understand system science.

It’s a very evolved field now. Now, the philosophers and the political scientists do not understand this. But I was able to figure out that these principles can be applied to understanding our body as a system, everything in nature as a system, including politics. So when I, when we say truth, freedom and health these, this is not a slogan and I don’t put ampersands in front of them.

Truth, freedom, health is an integrated set of three concepts that none of them can exist without the other. So in engineering system science, there’s three fundamental things that move the universe, transport, movement of information, matter and energy. Conversion processes, the things that take one thing to another, like digestion, for example, the movement of air transport, and the vessel which contains this, which is called the structural piece, transport, conversion, structure.

Guess what? The ancient Indians calls it called this Vata, Pitta and Kapha, which comes out of traditional medicine, which is really not a medical system. Truth, freedom and health says you need all three freedom, the ability for us to move freely, free, freedom of information, freedom of motion, matter and energy.

Convert the truth is really a verb in many ways, because the scientific method you put all sorts of ideas. In a truly free society, all those ideas are taken the scientific applied and you come to truth. Now, without freedom, you can’t even do that. You can’t apply the conversion process and health in many ways is a vessel.

The structural piece which contains is if you have a society, which is mentally, physically unhealthy or economically unhealthy. There’s no opportunity for freedom or science to take place. So that’s, so health in effect is the very basis. It’s a vessel. So in, in ancient systems of medicine, if you looked at your body, your gut was the earth element.

Which is where all the reactions took place the Country is the structure in which freedom can the extent of freedom and the extent of conversion I mean if I have this bowl of water here the vessel here if I make oatmeal Is the container, i’d mix stuff in there, right? That is the stirring and then the heat is a conversion element.

So in similar ways health is a physical structure that is Which contains the ability for us to do science, right? Or to fight for freedom, you can’t be fighting for freedom. If you’re physically unhealthy or mentally unhealthy, or you don’t have the economic capabilities to do that. So truth, freedom, health is literally coming out of this scientific framework.

And I believe what I’ve cracked the code on Nick. My journey, I’ve done many things. By the way, I invented the first email system. I do a lot of research in science. I’ve created platforms, but truth. Freedom health was really in many ways. My long journey since I was a four year old kid to apply engineering science to figure out the framework of how do we build revolutionary movements?

So revolution, what emerges out of this? The definition is that say, phase transition right from a very physical standpoint. If you take a block of ice, Under the right conditions, it becomes water and under the other right conditions become steam. These are revolutionary conditions when it undergoes these phase transitions.

What is difference between water and ice and, any of these, it’s the interconnections, it’s still water molecules, but they’re connected in a different way. So what we are, when we look at social systems, what we’re really saying is the relationships between you and I and others, right?

Today, those relationships are a slave relationship in fundamentally ways, right? You have a small set of people, Zionism. It fundamentally takes a political ideology and then has, melded it into some religious stuff which has nothing to do with Christianity. Brahmanism did the same thing.

It took the caste system, which is a political ideology, threw in some Hinduism. Nazism did the same thing, but it’s about promoting this concept. That a small set of people should rule the rest of us. So that is the state we’re in. Like ice or something. Now if we want to move this condition to another state, a phase transition, we have to understand systems.

And system science reveals that it is when we have enough particles vibrating at a different vibration. That is called a self organizing system. So that is why I’ve concluded that the only way to have revolutionary change is we need to have enough people. Understanding this dynamic. Understanding That’s the fundamental purpose of your election campaign.

The reason I’m running is So the reason I’m running is if someone like you or I is ever going to get elected at this height, it can only occur with such a revolutionary movement. There’s no other way to make it occur. It would be a pipe dream, but my running just like when I ran an mit phd with all these degrees is supposed to be in their little cubicle doing research, right?

But because I ran for office against elizabeth warren, we’re the ones who forced her to take that dna test nick I guess all these other parties wouldn’t have been so brash to say only the real indian can defeat the fake indian We had to file lawsuits when they said I had to remove the banner off my sign I had a picture of her in her headdress The city of Cambridge said you have to remove it.

I filed a lawsuit and I won. You see when we’re truly bottoms up, you don’t play by their rules. When I ran for office again, it was my election, which exposed the election fraud. Trump took all of my stuff and he made a half a billion. When I met with him, I said where did this half a billion go? Do you really want to solve election fraud?

He had no interest in solving it because he’s part of it. They profit from it. It was my running for office as an MIT Ph. D. in systems biology. We exposed Fauci for what he was. So my running stirs the pot in a significant way. So now my running for president, we have leaders all over the United States.

We’re building this movement and we are creating this infrastructure, which and we’re disseminating to people the real lesser of two evils. It is our movement that has exposed Kennedy for what he is. From these, bourgeois, quote unquote, white liberal women who think he’s fighting for their medical freedom when he isn’t, he openly says, I believe in full vaccination.

He’s a pro Zionist. He believes the Palestinian people are the most pampered people. He was happy to go see the bombing of Gaza. Meanwhile, he runs an organization called children’s health defense fund. But because I’m running. We’re able to expose this and we’re able to do this in a broad level. I did this video.

I’m not sure if I can curse on here, but I did a video, which said, I’m the only candidate who does not suck Zionist cock. And it just came out that went out to, I said, every other candidate is a Zionist cocksucker, which is true now and MIT PhD should not talk like that, but I also came from working class backgrounds.

So this dichotomy, Nick is really enlivening things. And it’s really, so my running for president. It’s very dangerous for them because a, we have to get on the ballot in every state, in order to get on the ballot, you have to collect signatures. So we have to collect 240, 000 signatures in, in in California, a thousand in Utah, a thousand in Idaho.

We collected all those signatures. Kennedy couldn’t even collect those signatures. You have to do a backroom deal because we actually have people bottoms up. We’ll go and collect signatures for every state. Every state has different numbers. So we have to build a national organization. The Democrats and Republicans, I’m convinced they just have a boiler room where people are writing them.

Kennedy is getting funded by, Zionist hoodlums who are doing deals for him. He’s actually hijacking other parties. So they’re cheating. We’re the only ones who actually play by the rules. So now that experience. Is creating veterans of our signature collectors, which are everyday working people.

We have electricians plumbers So one of our guys was arrested collecting signatures when it’s absolutely illegal an electrician in kentucky So what is this doing? It’s exposing further how corrupt the swarm is And people are finally getting to witness. Wait a minute. That guy Is one of us He came from working class backgrounds in New Jersey.

He’s one of us. Look how he speaks. He can on the one hand speak with multi syllabic words, talking about biology, but then he can also call people Zionist cocksuckers because I represent the act and that video, even though I’m under massive shadow banning on Twitter, got 2 million views. Okay. When I did the vitamin D3 videos, Nick, that got like 100 million views before it was taken down.

It But the point is, they don’t know what to do with an MIT PhD, who is supposed to have been co opted by them. And now we’re mobilizing other people with a foundational theoretical framework. By the way, England is one of our best places. We have close to 1400 volunteers and people. They’re interesting.

So can I ask you in passing? Just a video about vitamins was taken down. Why did the swarm feel the need to take down a video about vitamins? What’s interesting is I was the first one in March of 2020. I did a tweet I’m considered one of the leading guys on the immune system in the world. That’s on the research side.

I was invited by the national science foundation in 2019 to present their lecture on the modern science of the immune system. Okay. So in 2019, I said, this pandemic will go down and quote unquote, pandemic will go down in history to suppress, to strength, to send, destroy economies and destroy our health perfectly.

Boobie Kennedy was promoting lockdowns saying it was good for climate change. Trump was promoting lockdowns. So I called it on the money. And then I, given my research, I said, look, if you, I wrote a letter to Trump, which his ex wife, Marla Maples, delivered it to him. I said, please don’t shut down the economy.

You don’t need to do that. If people are truly ill, fine, quarantine them. But the rest of us, there’s, vitamin D3, quercetin, zinc. I laid out a whole protocol and I said, the rest of us should go back to work. So that video got like a hundred million views. Now, why did they take it down? The reason they took it down is an MIT PhD talking about using science that is against big pharma is dangerous because the reality is the big pharma industry has actually been going down.

Nick, a lot of people don’t understand over the last, since 2007, I’ll give you by way of example, Pfizer’s revenue. Has gone from 65 billion down to 40 billion in 2020. Pfizer’s revenue was going down. And a lot of people don’t understand this because I come from this world of doing systems biology. So systems biology basically realized that the pharmaceutical companies model of developing drugs is a very old medieval model.

They got some professor in some lab at MIT who finds a molecule, single molecule, synthesizing. And he tests it in a test tube to see if it kills cancer cells. Okay, if it does Then he goes and raises 40 million. Then after that, he goes and kills a bunch of animals. Now this process takes six years, but a couple of billion dollars, then they do phase one, phase two, phase three clinical tests.

Which take another, 5 billion. So the drug development process is taking 5 billion, a single drug, which can cause side effects. What comes out doesn’t actually help the target audience. Even the drugs that they’re created for a particular disease only help 10 percent of that. And this is well known.

This process takes 13 years. And so by the time the drug comes out, they only have seven years to make money off it because the U S patent are only for. 20 years. So that’s why this entire pharmaceutical model has been degrading. So this is why they needed the vaccine. The vaccine allowed them to not do this process, to violate that process and just get it out there quickly.

Operation Warp Speed. So this was a really a way to say pharma. Now the reality is that when you look at health and being, it is obvious That’s stress, physical, emotional, mental, physical stress is the number one cause. Of disease why because it destroys the immune system So when all of this was occurring nick I was educating people as a leader on the immune system Create a resilient immune system and over the last 70 years globally We’ve been destroying people’s immune systems and it’s not any one thing.

It’s been income inequality, right? It’s been the reality of Toxins in the environment. It’s been the reality of the immense stress people are under. , community. Community. The reason people live long is physical community number. Forget whether you smoke or drink or what you eat. It has been shown over and over again out of all the.

Anti a people live centenarians. The number one reason they live long was because it’s close social community, friends, family, relationships. And when you destroyed that, you destroy health. People are nervous. They get stressed out. Cortisol go. Community was number one. Number two was some type of physical exercise.

And number three was believe it or not. Most of these cultures ate some type of fermented drink, which brain access. So we have been, the elites have been intentionally destroying people’s immune systems. Can I just ask you one point on that? How harmful do you think the masks were?

I was the first one who wrote a paper on masks, how harmful they were. Okay. And not only that we educated it. We combined the science. We did the first mask conference in 2019 and 2020 and the reality is that the masks, literally, I just did a paper on a published in a major journal on periodontal disease.

Okay. People are getting mask mouth, because what happens when you wear the mask, obviously for people where you know kids are wearing for eight hours, separate from the mental issues you can’t see someone’s face. Yep. From an educational standpoint, you really screw up someone’s mental. Development when they can’t see someone’s face on the physiological level, the mouth has around 700 microbes.

Some of those microbes operate, the good ones operate well, when the pH is at a certain level. When you wear these masks, you’re altering the pH, the alkalinity of the body, so you’re destroying the mouth. This is why people are getting more cavities, more gum issues during the pandemic.

And oral health is related to every other health in the body. These people literally destroy, now what we did, Nick, is during that time, I wrote a scientific paper. Truth. Then we went and mobilized mothers to use that paper to challenge their school boards and scare them and saying we can sue you in your individual capacity.

So we actually resolved these issues. So our movement delivered the truth. We gave people the way to fight and then connected to the health issue. This is why we have to connect science, the fight for freedom, and connect it to health. You can’t separate these things. So this is why we were a formidable force in this.

I ran some of the biggest anti vax the the vax mandate protests while Kennedy was promoting all this. So we developed, Nick, enough prestige and respect among the broad mass of people, about a half a billion people uniquely saw all those videos during that time. And this is why, during 2020, 2021, our, it was hard for them because wait a minute, here’s an MIT PhD with all these credentials.

Talking about this. It wasn’t some just woo guy. So this is why we got a lot of our information out there during that period. And then when they put me back on Twitter, you will see there’s massive shadow banning. That’s the model that they’re doing. The model is they give you the illusion. That’s what, Elon Musk was brought in for.

He’s an agent from swarm where Elon Musk begins. Where Zionism ends, where government ends, nobody knows. He went and bowed down to Netanyahu, we have this very interesting development now, where I feel like the old establishment is going to go away, because people have figured them out, and the neo establishment is forming.

The neo media establishment. The fucker Carlson. The Kennedys. The Trumps, the Alex Joneses, right? They’re coming together to act like they’re anti establishment. And they’re going to be forced to create their own not so obvious establishment version of themselves, which would be like a Candace Owens. So they’re metamorphosis, metamorphosing, metamorphosizing, in order to make sure the working people still became stuck to them. But I think the advantage we have is we’re here. We’re able to explain this physics. So in my view, Nick, each person who understands this dynamic that we’re talking about, the real lesser of two evils, this dynamic of the obvious and not so obvious.

To me, this is central to winning. This is key that people understand this dynamic. I thought that the, looking back, I thought that the whole pandemic thing had awakened a staggering number of people to at least begin to question, and research themselves and so on. And I thought until October the 6th, I thought that’s the awakening thing of our time.

Everything else is not finished yet, but it started a process. Rolling which can indeed create real revolutionary change in future. And I thought that would be the thing of our time. October the 7th, of course, I think now is something which is, I think, awakening even more people even more deeply or rather how Zionists have responded to the thing that they helped create in the first place, right?

I think it’s a staggering thing. And you were talking about, vibrations. through the population earlier on. I feel that what’s happening now in Gaza, and it’s going obviously to happen in the West Bank and so on as well is an absolutely critical point in our time. And 11, it was before 9 11, after 9 11.

9 11 now is small beer, I think, compared to October the 7th. What do you think? Yeah so here’s my position on this. I believe there will be no revolutionary change unless It’s consciously organized. The iPhone didn’t just come into being. Someone had to build this, apply all sorts of materials, technology, physics, everything.

So I don’t believe things just happen spontaneously, Nick. So this has been among movement people. You’ll hear them say, Oh, Dr. Shiva, when things get really bad, then your movements can explosively grow. I go, no, it’s not true. When things get bad, when people get oppressed, they get more oppressed. You have to use these lulls to actually build organized conscious movements.

So during the pandemic phase, quote unquote, pandemic. We were out there in 2020. So I think it’s very timing is very important when you organize people. And this is why booby Kennedy was unleashed. He waited one year and he stole most of my material to write this Fauci book. So what? The establishment is very clever.

Nick, they have so much data right now. If you look at system science, it’s called controllability and observability, right? So all of government, has hooks into social media. They’re one. So with all of this data, they can do enormous work. I used to be in this field for nearly 20, 20 years. Data science AI With very simple algorithms.

They now know which way people are moving So when I did that video, I did a series of videos clearly establishing the difference between zionism anti zionism and anti semitism So obviously that sent out a signal into their universe. They’re like, holy shit. People are realizing this difference So what they had to do was they had to react to that so they’re getting real time data now So they know wow these activists are getting it So in response to that, the controllability comes in, we have to now blur anti Zionism and anti Semitism, or make it even unlawful.

So they had this dude, Mike Johnson, who’s a speaker, the day that he comes into office on December, he passes a resolution saying, Hey, That anti Zionism is equal to anti Semitism. And then they passed a bill, by the way, those two resolutions and bills started with an executive order. Donald Trump signed in 2016.

So the trajectory is they’re getting data. So we have to be aware they’re getting data and they’re manipulating the inputs, which is propaganda. And they’re being able to react very, they have to also react fast. So this phenomenon needs to be understood. And this is why Musk is central to them. Elon Musk and the social, the heads of these social media companies.

So when they see a phenomenon, they react to control the propaganda to control us. And this is occurring in a very engineering it’s being engineered. When you look at the pandemic, they saw that coming, they saw all these videos that I was doing and they created the fake anti establishment people.

I saw it occurring right before my eyes. They created these people who waited, didn’t say anything, ran Paul, waited a year, and then we started the Fire Fauci campaign, hashtag Fire Fauci. He waited a year. So they have this ability. So when October 7th took place, you can see now that the liberal Zionists have embedded themselves into these movements.

So they don’t say end the I went over to MIT and Harvard, right? They have these encampments. And in those encampments, you will see very few signs against Zionism. Free Palestine in 1980. Nick, when I was a student at MIT, we organized one of the true working class protests where we, so in 1980s, you may remember many of these universities were investing in South Africa.

Okay. Endowments, one set of students. Oh, okay. We’r people there. Okay. That another set of libera play martin Luther King s know, we need to help the

We’re afraid to go into the black neighborhoods within the one mile radius of MIT. I was living in one of those neighborhoods when I was an undergrad because I moved off campus. Our position as a revolutionary agents of change, we said, look, it’s easy to talk about something 10, 000 miles away in Soweto or, Johannesburg.

Why don’t we look at the economic apartheid right on this campus? So we organized the food service workers, the custodial workers, together. It was very different because we were really the real wing there. And so when we built our movement, the workers and the students at MIT were all supporting us. You see what I’m saying?

So we didn’t have this dialectic where the cops, in fact, the cops were afraid to touch us. Now, when I went over to MIT, everyone’s about free Palestine and it all says cease fire now. Now cease fire now has been a slogan of the liberal Zionists who take over these movements. Ceasefire now is interesting.

Ceasefire now, which means the Zionists in Israel can go two steps forward and one step back. And that slogan has been used for 40 years. The right slogan in the United States is end the occupation of America by Zionism. Now, this is much more powerful because that means you have to take a position to look at all the economic interests.

That Zionism is infiltrated. So if you want to really free Palestine, it’s not going to happen without ending Zionism in the United States. So the liberal quote unquote, Zionist, the liberal Zionist, quote unquote, liberal Zionist. Are running many of these campus movements and they’re containing them. They do not want this discussion Okay, if you want to talk about zionism in palestine, why don’t you talk about zionism right here in the united states?

They don’t want that expansion of that movement Same thing is occurring all over the middle east even though there’s been a lot of anti zionist protests All of the Zionist Middle East leaders, be it in Turkey, be it in Saudi Arabia, they’re, UAE, they’re just putting up with their public, but they’re concerned that their own people, the Arab population there, or the anti Zionist population, will one day point their guns at them.

Of course. There’s been, even the New York Times reported, there’s been mass arrests. In many of these quote unquote Arab countries of anti Zionist activists now. So this dynamic of the real lesser of two evils is a dynamic that needs to be exposed if we’re going to win. So I don’t believe things are just going to happen, Nick.

So I think the elites are very smart. They’re watching this. They’re containing these campus movements and to the extent, visually, they want to show the police come in and butcher these students or brutally attack them to send the learned helplessness. See, you can’t do anything. And in Columbia, I don’t know if you’ve been to Columbia University, it’s in, so if you go to Columbia University, it’s on 125th Street.

So if you look at New York City as a big rectangle of streets, Third, about 40th Street to 70th Street is called the Gold Coast. It’s middle Manhattan. Okay. But 125th street is Harlem. It’s all poor people around Columbia university. So the student misleaders, the liberal elites will talk about free Palestine, but they’re not going into the communities and mobilizing the working people and saying, look, you have economic apartheid here and connecting the same enemy who does this in.

Israel is the same enemy who is doing it to you. And that mobilization is intentionally being contained. Because in Zionism, we point the fingers at Zionism in the United States, and they want to contain it. Oh, okay, you can talk about Zionism, but talk about Palestine. So this is where I think you need to have political theory, systems theory.

To understand these interconnections of these movements will be contained by the quote unquote not so obvious establishment because they’re seeing things coming, Nick. They got the data. So they send in their fake heroes to hijack these movements. So we need to be aware of that and contain them so we don’t connect it to local issues.

Yes. Can I ask you that as a systems engineer and expert in this I’m not. So I look at the way in which the elite are being pushed in effect by the fact that people are discussing the truth and getting it out there. They’re being pushed to co opt more and more of our ideas and slogans, which is a very clever thing to do, but is it also, to me, it appears to be a very dangerous thing to do because.

They’re legitimizing to a degree discussions of things and moving things in our general direction. And at the same time as they’re doing this with their system, which is, okay, it’s very clever what they’re doing. They’ve got access to lots of data, but it’s still a massively complex system that they’re trying to manipulate.

And at the same time as they’re doing that, you’ve got a major wing. Of their whole operation, that the people, the net zero people who were doing something which I think is unparalleled, perhaps apart from Cambodia many years ago, I think it’s unparalleled in human history that in the past, you had elites who they want to get control because they want a big chunk of the pie.

But if they messed up the economy, it was really by accident. They had a, an economic policy, which was crazy and ideological. We’re not going to work, etc at variance for human nature. So previous elites have wanted to get hold of everything. And if they’ve made if someone’s gone wrong, it’s been a mistake.

You’ve now got an elite who are deliberately destroying, so sorry, under communism for instance, communism capitalism was at least in theory a, an argument over who should own the means of reduction, distribution, and exchange. Exactly. You’ve now got an elite who are determined to destroy the means of production and distribution and exchange, especially obviously in food and energy, which are the basis in many ways of modern society and certainly the large population we’ve got now.

So when you’ve got a section of the elite who are trying to destroy the system on which we, and even they depend, at the same time as they’re being forced to co opt More and more radical ideas in order to try and keep them tame. Do you think that is a, an opportunity for future revolution? Or are they able to control this system, even doing those things?

Well, Nick, this is what the elites are doing, okay? This is their problem. And we call it a control system. They’re highly unstable. So if I take this pen and I put this on this, try to balance it. Very difficult. It’s very, now there are a lot of vehicles that you can use to balance this. Okay.

But this is a highly unstable system, to try to balance this pen, it’s going to fall over. The military many years ago, they used to build airplanes, which are, airplanes go backward, they started building airplanes that went forward. It’s called front swept wing airplanes, highly unstable airplanes, but they can move very fast.

If you could. Stabilize them. And that’s why they started building these helmets, which could observe. The pilot’s thoughts. Okay. And this is why they started doing AI. The reason I’m sharing this with is that highly unstable systems need massive control to stabilize. Okay. So as we head into this world of instability for the elites, their only solution is massive control, even greater control as you’ve never imagined.

So this is why the monitoring of social media. Okay. Getting all this predictive data seeing. So one of the books I wrote was called the future of email, which talks about where is all of this going? So you need, so all of this is about controllability and observability. You have observabilities, you have to gather enough data.

To know how we are thinking in different parts of the world in a micro level at a macro level. So that’s the infrastructure they put in place because they have a highly unstable system. If you want to balance that this pen, you have to have sensors, which knows, oops, it’s going this way. Okay, let me go this way.

You have to go, right? So you need enough sensors. So the swarm is going to get even more interconnected because throughout the world, they have to be able to get a lot of data and they have to work together. Okay. So that’s one phenomenon that’s going to, that has to happen just from an engineering standpoint, and then they’re going to have to put enough control mechanisms in that can act very quickly.

Cause this stuff is going to be unstable here and here. So we’re heading into this world right now from a pure engineering systems approach that it’s step by step. They know they have to put more control mechanisms in. So think about from may 1st, which was international workers day, which was by the way, to commemorate American workers were hanged in the Haymarket riots, fighting for the eight hour work day, which America changed to law day on that day.

is when the U. S. House of Representatives unanimously, 320 to 91 all the Zionist cocksuckers passed a rule equating anti Zionism with anti Semitism. This is no coincidence, right? It’s step by step. Mentally and physically, the elites are boiling the pot at a much faster rate.

Meanwhile, by doing this, they’re also creating instabilities because people like our movement exist. Guys like you exist who are calling this out. So they are going to have to adopt more of our slogans, be more and more manipulative. They’re going to have to create more fucker Carlson’s, more Alex Jones’s, more Joe Rogan’s who will talk the talk.

So they’re creating a highly unstable situation for themselves. So that instability is why it demands a movement, why it demands the theoretical framework that I’ve come up with, so people understand this, because without theory, we won’t be able to enable these movements to really grow, because they will be one step ahead, because they understand the same system science, I used to teach this at MIT, at a PhD level, they are studying this at the Fletcher School of Law and Diplomacy, they’re studying this at the Kennedy School of Government, they’re studying this at Oxford and Cambridge, So this is very important for us to understand.

The level of understanding that they’ve had to develop. Otherwise they wouldn’t be able to control 8 billion of us. So this is central for people to understand. And that’s why I think our movement is extremely important because we’ve taken this knowledge, made it accessible to the average person. We have a hairdresser who’s teaching it to a PhD at the university of Chicago.

So it’s taking this very powerful knowledge, making it accessible to the masses and then engaging them to get on the ground and educate other people. Because I am very optimistic. That once people understand this dynamic, and we don’t have to have enough people understand, we don’t need millions, Nick, I think we need about 10, 000 in different parts of the world.

That will create that vibration because it’ll be very difficult because we’re exposing the controlled opposition wherever we go. And then people are going to have to look at themselves and say, okay, what is real now? What is a real movement? And they’re going to realize it comes from you advancing your consciousness, you becoming an active citizen.

It’s not going to come from above. You have to put on the mantle of a citizen at every level of mother or father, a working class person is going to have to do that, that they have to stop complaining and whining, thinking something’s going to save them from above and when it hits enough numbers and it doesn’t have to be millions.

It’s going to create that vibration what we call a self organizing system. So that’s what science, reveals to me. Now I’m conscious that we’re getting, I think we’re probably over an hour actually. Oh yeah, I’m sorry. Yeah. It’s not a problem for me. It’s only if it’s a problem for you. I have a call coming up in six minutes.

Okay. So we can finish off fairly soon. The one thing which we didn’t switch, which we said at the beginning, we were going to cover, but we haven’t mentioned to an extent is the looming possibility of World War III, or at least it appears to be, do you think that the apparently insane elite push for war on several fronts is to do with money ideology or something to do with keeping us busy and under control.

Look, this is the gen it’s a lot of people say, you know I have a friend of mine who tracks all of these he goes Okay, putin just put the missiles up in the air right putin’s doing this, Oh my god, this is happening, world war three is imminent, right? Or another pandemic is coming, right?

My view on this is a following, Nick, is that we, as people who are trying to deliver real change we can’t do much about what the elites decide to do in that level. Let them, they may do World War 3, World War 4, World War 5. They may blow up some cities. The issue is, nonetheless, The long game is we have to build a bottoms up movement, which has been avoided for the last 50, 60 years.

Our parents should have done this. What has happened over the last 60 years is that the elites have advanced their agenda of using these not so obvious establishment people. So we became suppressed and stayed on the plantation and didn’t build our own movement. So now we’re at a point in history where people like, Oh my God, we can’t, we have to do something now, Trump.

Yeah, I agree. Trump is a agent of the swarm booby is an agent of Zionism, not right now, Dr. Shiva, not right now, Nick, we have to do this now. So the sense of urgency that they’re creating is to, again, support the swarms agenda, which is, you’re going to have to choose one of them and you choose any one of them and you lose.

So my theory on this is we have to focus on the fact, the singular fact that the, those in power do not want us to build a bottoms up movement to me. That’s a central principle. Fine. They want to do World War three. We will give our political analysis of it, do our polemics, but we still need to build a bottoms up movement.

So that’s my position on this. We still need to get people. We still need to educate people on this dynamic because all right, you’re going to blow up some. Okay. Parts of the world. I frankly cannot do anything about that. And it may be one organized crime family, not liking another organized crime family, right?

That’s what a lot of this is fundamentally about the one wing of the organized crime family shoots the Kennedy’s all right, but they were an organized crime family who was stealing. And then they want us to feel, they want us to get lost in this world, which we have no say over. They own that battlefield, Nick.

So I think we need to shift our consciousness. All right, fine. You may do another pandemic. You may do this, you may do this. You know what? I’m going to do this, and this, and we’re going to grow our movement. That’s the conclusion I’ve come to because in many views, that’s another distraction, so we don’t mobilize ourselves.

Yeah, I come to a rather similar conclusion actually having been very involved in electoral politics and so on and policies and things and all this effort into working out what would we do with the economy or this or that or the other way. And in fact, the important thing is to encourage people, young people to settle down in and have families and to rear their children away from.

The educational Inverted commas from the brainwashing systems, whether it’s the school system or the internet or mtv or whatever because this is potentially a multi generational thing and it is about, in the end, it’s about human beings living decent human lives and people don’t live decent human lives as individuals.

We live them as families and communities. So rather than worrying about the perfect policy for running the Bank of England or whatever, People without much power do have the power to make their own family and their own community in some way better and more resilient, and that’s where we need to start.

Yeah, so I think the understanding of systems and dynamics helps people give them the framework to do that because what’s happened is, Nick, people don’t have a framework anymore. To understand why it’s come from religion has been, some of that has been hijacked by Zionism. Christianity has been hijacked, in the United States, 70 million Christian Zionists.

So this approach that I’ve taken is a much more grounded approach. It’s independent, it’s secular, but it grounds people to understand you still get to the same point. That it’s about community. It’s about locally organizing. And yeah, the reality is. I don’t think the elites want to blow up the world.

I think they just want to make us more slaves. This is my position on it because it’s maximizing power profit control for themselves. To the extent that we get lost in their fear and we keep choosing one of their lesser of two evils, they win. So we have to drive our agenda, which is take care of your health, understand, understand how to fight for freedom, understand the importance of truth and science.

And and that’s what we’re doing. And we are organizing people locally. And telling people, okay, they’re going to do what they want to do, but what are you doing? And we’re un brainwashing people to ask the right questions. People say what do you think about Trump? My question is, what do I think about you?

You should ask yourself, what do you, what are you going to do? What is your son going to do? What’s your daughter going to do? They need to flip these questions because these questions are coming from thinking something’s going to come from outside. They have immense power. There’s eight billion of us.

There’s about a hundred thousand of them. They have immense power. Potentially we have far bigger power. Exactly. All right, Nick. This was great. Yeah. Great talk. Great talking to you. Thank you ever so much. I’ve already enjoyed it. I’m sure that my viewers will find it very interesting. Hope to see you again in due course and the best of luck with your campaign.

Thank you, Nick. Be well. Best to you. Bye bye. All right, everyone. That was my interview with Nick Griffin. I hope you guys enjoyed it. But the bottom line is we need to build a bottoms up movement. And how can you guys help? Number one, I’m running for president. You guys should go get one of these bumper stickers right now.

Okay. Go to Shiva for president and get one of these bumper stickers. It’s right there. It’s very simple. The second thing you can do is you can go to Shiva for president. There’s a flyer in the download section. Download it, hand it out to as much people. It in one little eight and a half by 11 piece of paper.

It consolidates all of this. Okay. Number three, become a truth, freedom, health warrior scholar, because this is the only way for us to win for you to get this understanding. It took me 50 years to understand this knowledge. We’ve made it accessible, affordable to everyone. And furthermore, when you go through this program and you learn this, you can give it away to as many children as you want.

So you have no excuse because You can support this important campaign we’re doing in the United States. Globally, you can get involved in our movement because we have many different amazing leaders and groups emerging with Truth, Freedom, Health, so you can be a part of the solution at a very deep level.

The elites will do what they want to do, but we have to build our movement. And let me just share with you this video, which will really give you the understanding of what is truth, freedom, health. And I’ll be right back to say goodbye to all. We have allowed our country to be taken over from within.

And the end goal is you will have a homogenized world where we will become slaves. Because there is a condition among the elites that really thinks they’re better than you, deep down inside them, that you don’t deserve the freedoms you have. They don’t. This reality is what people need to wake up to, and we need to all unite working people.

There’s only one movement that can do that, and that is the movement that we started creating here in Massachusetts, the Movement for Truth, Freedom, and Health. Look, I’ve been a student of politics since I was a four year old kid. Setting revolutionary movements, left wing, right wing. There’s a physics, there’s a nuclear science to destroying the establishment.

To build a bridge, you need to understand Newton’s equation. You need to understand the laws of gravity. You need to understand Poisson’s ratio. There is a way to build a revolution and that’s why I put this together. My goal is to train a army of truth, freedom, and health leaders. We don’t need followers like social media.

We need leaders, but they need training because the educational system does not teach them history, nothing. So in three hours, that’s what I’ve started doing. That’s the solution. We got to train people first with understanding what a system is, the dynamics of all systems that affect nature. The second is understanding the interconnection between truth, freedom, and health freedom is the ability to move freely, communicate freely, talk freely.

Without freedom, you cannot convert ideas, hypothesis into truth, which is science. And without freedom, you can’t really get to truth. And without truth, you make up fake problems and fake solutions, which means you destroy our health. And without health, which is the infrastructure of us and our body, you can’t fight for freedom, truth, freedom, health.

Third concept is it has to be bottoms up working people who work uniting. And what the right wing has done is whenever you say working people unite, that must be communist. Meanwhile, they’ve let the Democrats run unions, which suppress workers. Completely corrupt. But when you look at the arc of American history, it’s been when working people came up.

We need to go local. Every solution I’m coming up with is a part of this movement. We’re giving the science, which is a truth, and then we tell people what they can do on the ground. Like with election fraud, you don’t need to wait for some lawyer. Our goal is to train people to go local.

Fight locally. Forget lawyers, forget politicians, forget celebrities. You’ve got to learn politics, and there is a science to it. They lock us down, we should be ready to shut them down. And the fourth part of this principle is a not so obvious establishment. So when you look at a system, there’s always something that disturbs you from getting to your goal.

The biggest disturbance is the not so obvious establishment. Which are those people who claim they’re for you. On the left and the right. The Al Sharptons who tell black people I’m for you. The Tucker Carlsons. Do you think any true anti establishment person will ever be on Fox or CNN? I don’t think so.

They both mislead working people back into the establishment. Without this system. solid understanding of political physics and theory, you’re screwed. You’re going to follow on the left wing Bernie Sanders, oh he said something, or Robert Kennedy, scumbags. Or you’re going to follow some right wing talk show host.

They’re not going to lead us to liberation, it’s us. We’re building a bottoms up movement and that political physics It’s a nuclear science of change. Bottoms up. We have to organize to understand that there is people who talk a good game and then look at what they actually do. Left and right. I’m sorry, Sean Hannity may say some good things, but I don’t see the urgency in his voice to get something done.

And it can only come after. When you weaponize yourself with the right knowledge, you need to be able to identify a rat. Christ didn’t go after the Romans, right? It was the Pharisees and the Sadducees who screwed him up. His own quote unquote people. And that’s where we’re at. So these four concepts I’ve built into a curriculum.

People can go to truthfreedomhealth. com and it’s an educational program. We need to train people in political theory. You need to have physics. And I’ve created that curriculum. People need to get educated. We need to get educated fast and within a half an hour, I can teach people two years of MIT control systems.

I teach people those concepts that I apply it. Anyone can understand it. And then you say, Oh, I got to build a bottoms up movement. They have to get politically astute and then they have to go locally and act, not sit there on social media. They have to act locally. Defy locally, do civil obedience locally, but with knowledge on how to build a movement.

And the Senate campaign’s expanded to the movement for truth, freedom, and health, and they can find it on truthfreedomhealth. com So people can sign in, they can get access to a bunch of videos. If they want to take a course and become a Truth, Freedom, Health leader, I offer a full scholarship there. But we want people to make a commitment that they’ll study, that they’ll get certified, that they’ll go do activities on the ground.

So go to truthfreedomhealth. com

Alright everyone, I hope that was valuable be well, be the light, get involved we have a huge opportunity. We need to build a bottoms up movement. Go to shiva4president. com and volunteer. 

It’s time we move beyond the Left vs. Right, Republican vs. Democrat. It’s time YOU learn how to apply a systems approach to get the Truth Freedom Health® you need and deserve. Become a Truth Freedom Health® Warrior.

Join the VASHIVA community – an integrated EDUCATIONAL, COMMUNICATIONS – independent of Big Tech -, and LOCAL ACTIVISM platform to empower YOU to actualize Truth Freedom Health® in your local communities by employing a SYSTEMS APPROACH.

The platform we are building for Truth Freedom Health® provides the infrastructure to take on Big Tech, Big Pharma, and Big Academia. Many of you have asked how you can help. You can contribute whatever you can. Based on your level of commitment to get educated, I have also created some wonderful educational gifts to thank you for your contribution.

To get the education you need and deserve, join Dr.SHIVA on his Foundations of Systems™ course. This course will provide you three pillars of knowledge with the Foundation of Systems™ Thinking. The three pillars include: 1) The System Dynamics of Truth Freedom Health®, 2) The Power of a Bottom’s Up Movement, and 3) The Not So Obvious Establishment. In this course, you will also learn fundamental principles of all systems including your body.

Course registration includes access to his LIVE Monday training, access to the Your Body, Your System® tool, four (4) eBooks including the bestselling System and Revolution, access to the Systems Health® portal and communications tools – independent of Big Tech – including a forum and social media for you to build community with other Truth Freedom Health® Warriors.

This course is available online for you to study at your own pace.

It’s time to Get Educated, or Be Enslaved™.

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